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Wednesday, August 25, 2010
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58 comments:
Hey krisjim26, Can you email me directly? I tried your previous email, but it no longer works.
Thanks
Frank
FranklyMLS
OK, this is part vent, part house hunting story.
We have beeen looking for a house for a few months now, and the neighborhood we've been targeting is Pimmit Hills. Driving through the streets a couple of weeks ago we saw a "coming soon" sign on this house http://www.redfin.com/VA/Falls-Church/1803-Pimmit-Dr-22043/home/9396635. Were interested immediately, contacted the agent, went to see and submitted the offer (full asking price, no CC request) on Saturday before the open house. On Monday morning the agent calls and says the listing agent asked to submit an escalation clause and waive HI and appraisal contingencies. We submitted an escalation clause of up to 460K, made HI "take it or leave it" and offered to pay up to 10K if appraisal came in short. This morning we were told that they had four offers, two of them higher than ours, so they went with the higher offer.
The thing is, unless people are paying cash, I really don't see this house getting appraised for over 460K. I made a few calls to my lender and they saw values of 426-449K in their database. I know I'm pissed and sour-grapesy and probably unreasonable. It feels like daym! what does a girl have to do to find a house! Plus I think waiving HI is really unwise and even though we were approved to borrow a much higher amount than that, it's still contingent upon appraisal and we don't want to have to add 20K to 40K in cash to get the house. Our agent says "just wait and it will come back to the market, no way it will pass appraisal at over 460K". Grrrrr!!!! Did we do a reasonable thing by sticking to our guns, or are we simply being clueless at writing competitive offers? Please say something to make me feel better.
Oddly enough, I do see multiple properties going under contract and then coming back to the system again in a few weeks. Are people's loans coming apart? or appraisals not coming in? It seems really rampant.
NN-
I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but that price seems reasonable based on a lot of comps I have seen.
comp 1 This went for 425K was 25% smaller and a lot uglier
comp 2 this went for 439K and was a little smaller and not as nice.
There are also a lot of totally non-updated houses that went for ~400K. I can also find lower comps, but as long as there are a bunch of comps in the ball park I wouldn't be surprised if it passed
NN-
My guess is there is a lot of both. I think a lot of peoples credit history isn't as good as they led a bank to believe so when the bank gets their information they refuse to give the person a loan.
Then I hate our agent for not advising us properly...we could have escalated more but I don't see us waiving HI or appraisal contingencies. Just not prudent.
You were right not to waive HI or appraisal contingencies. That way lies madness.
It's a beautiful kitchen, if anything was going to get multiple offers right now, something like this would. Just because hb may be right that it may appraise for $460k doesn't mean that the winning bidders won't be overpaying.
Have you figured out how to run a comp search yourself on frankly? On the final price that you're willing to do you have to trust your own gut, not your realtors, no matter how good they are.
Personally I would just try to chalk this up to yet another of the million plus homes in NoVa that I won't be owning. You only need one, let someone else overpay in a bidding war for the sake of good photography and a pretty (but tiny) kitchen.
NN-
I agree with you that you should not waive those contingencies. I also agree that the house should not appraise for over 460K, I just don't have a lot of faith in the appraisal process. I think as long as there are a couple of example of houses that will let it appraise then the appraiser will use these houses and ignore the rest. The house you listed is also one of the nicest house I have seen in that size range in pimmit which also makes the appraisal difficult.
NN -
I'm also pretty fond of Redfin's comp listings. If you look up a property there, you see comps they suggest. Or you can map an area near your property by zooming and then look for solds over a variety of time periods (week, month, 3/6 mo etc).
NN,
You wrote: "I don't see us waiving HI or appraisal contingencies. Just not prudent."
Well it can be very prudent if done correctly. Or you can do it the safe way and overpay by $30k.
You don't have to be so black and white about it. There are creative hybrids that can protect yourself and still make your contract attractive.
For example, why do you want a home inspection? Because you want to make sure the house isnt falling off the cliff (major issues), or because you want to make sure all the light bulbs work? Why not put a high threshold? "Buyer will waive the first $5k of issues" or something like that. So you are protected from a huge issue, but the seller knows you won't nickle and dime them.
As for the appraisal, if the risk is you don't have the money, then I get it, you can't waive it. But if you have a "worst case scenario" extra $20k, you can waive up to $20k over the appraisal. And remember, many appraisals are a crock. If you REALLY know values in that area and you love the house, who cares if an appraiser from West Va thinks it is overpriced? (unless it blocks you from getting a loan, and in that case you get a new appraisal)
And you shouldn't blame your agent for not pushing you to go higher. Heck, it is MUCH easier to just say "add $25k." It is harder to keep a client in check, not get overexcited and try and get the best price.
RANT ALERT -
wouldn't "possible mold in bsmt" be an "extremely urgent" matter to property owners? i saw something one the bsmt carpet and emailed a pic to my landlord, but he said it's not extremely urgent so he'll get back to me.
WTF is wrong with this world!
[rant over]
Hi Frank~
since you're here today, what's with all the blocked listings?
Tks!
Just wanted to say thanks to everyone for their help yesterday. I decided not to tour the condo today after all.
Thanks to someone's pointer to hotpads.com, I found out there are a handful of foreclosures still to go on market in the building, which is either a good opportunity or (more likely) a red flag I should pay attention to ... I'm not sure the wave of shorts/foreclosure is over ... I'm guessing some 5 yr ARMS will still be coming due this year or next.
For now, I'm going to see what happens with the two units that went under contract earlier this month, and also wait and see if I can find out %investor owned, delinquent on HOA etc.
And after reading all day yesterday about problems with condo mortgages since the 2009 changes went into effect, the ramblers in Springfield with express bus to Pentagon are looking a lot more attractive!
NN
never get in a stupid war,
there are plenty more places
in Pimmitt hills and if you
don't like the price wait a bit.
Look around at Foreclosure heat maps,
look around at Prices paid during the bubble and realize that some joker
paid $700K for the place down the block and will some day wake up
and walk on that mortgage.
All that underwater supply will eventually reappear.
I know people don't like credit claims because of their clearances and jobs but you know what,
if you are paying into a bad investment for 20 years, the hit now may beat the hit later.
I fully expect everyone in vegas to walk at some point. 80% of all houses there are in negative equity.
newbieinNoVa,
Springfield express bus to Pentagon is my neighborhood (amongst others). (King's Park) No ramblers at the moment, but I do highly recommend the neighborhood. The trail around Lake Accotink is great. Parliament Pool in the summer. The VRE is also quite convenient from King's Park depending on where you're headed and parking is free at Rolling Rd and never seems to fill up.
But these 60s ramblers can be a lot of work. About 1/5th of owners use a lawn service though...
cara,
I'd absolutely use a lawn service ... my 15-yr-old nephew lives in PA :).
I do like the area; have family over on the other side of the mall, and would enjoy the access to Trader Joe's and Whole Paycheck!
Have been an urban dweller all my adult life, but unless I come into some money (or decide I can get by with 1bed/1bath -- ugh), it's hard to beat the prices!
newbie,
Whole Paycheck is ridiculously convenient. Mmm fresh cherries. The new Thai place in that same mall isn't bad. Nor is the "thai" (actually semi-indonesian...) place near Trader Joes. It is hard to beat the prices in King's Park, they're a little artificially high right now because of the last of the tax credit, but given that three out of four active seller's are flippers, they are going to have to settle for what they can more realistically get soon. The $419k flipped rambler was too close to Braddock Road noise anyway, so I wouldn't say you missed out there.
But it is very different than city living. And I've long since come to the realization that I'm not a city person so I can't speak to the change.
cara,
I'm avoiding flips ... seems nuts to pay a premium for what's probably little better than standard builder grade finishes. Especially when that usually includes cheapish neutral carpet. I want hardwoods in main space and hate the idea of ripping up new carpet even if it's lacking.
Your comment yesterday got me thinking about how a one-level rambler could work for me. But since they are all way pre-78, had been debating if I wanted to deal with the lead paint issues.
newbie,
The flips around here never put new carpet over the hardwood. That wouldn't sell. But my point was not that you should buy them (they're all 2 stories), just that as flippers they HAVE to sell to get their cash back, and thus these should soon provide lower comps for the neighborhood again.
Just don't eat the paint? Seriously the best way to deal with it is paint over it. Yes, all future renovations will need to be tented off from the rest of the house. Annoying, possibly more expensive, yes. Not a huge deal though.
There are newer ramblers in Springfield/Burke, but they aren't down in the low 400's price-wise. Or weren't last I checked...
cara,
I've seen a lot of flips w/ boring beige carpet ... assumed that the original house had bad floors or carpeting. But your point re potential effect on prices is a good one.
I've been looking for a while at the area bordered by Hanover, Highland & Backlick. Weird to see some of the mini mcmansions built on these lots!
FX7421932
Once again, if you're going to be that "guy" (or gal) who insists on doing their own fixer-upper learn the basics. Which includes not putting the AC vent in the shower in your craptastic basement full bath addition so you can say "it has two full baths even if you have to scooch past the washer and dryer on a dirty basement floor."
(shaking head) Is it me or do county inspectors do their work with a 5th of Scotch in this part of the country?
And rigging up the washer drain the year or so you were in the home Mr. Caveman wouldn't have killed you.
LOL. Single guys. Sometimes they leave a trail in more than one place.
Hey MM, They threatened to sue me. I decided to pull them all. Hope you don't mind.
Frank
Pat,
I respectfully disagree with your blanket statement to not get into bidding wars.
Actually bidding wars are oftentimes the best deal.
For example, there is a condo right now in Clarendon. It listed for $399k. It should be $450k- $475k. If I didn't have a new baby and the start of law school classes, I would have bought it.
Supposedly it is under contract now. They had "2" offers. That is a bidding war. My guess is it maybe went up to $420k.
I would rather have won that bidding war than gotten $50k off on a $100k overpriced home.
Bidding wars can be GREAT!
Blogger FRANK LL0SA Va Broker- BLOG.FranklyRealty.com said... Hey MM, They threatened to sue me. I decided to pull them all. Hope you don't mind. Frank
Hey Frank,
Thanks for the update. Was it because you ran over someone's cat or because it was a Tuesday?
;)
But Frank, wouldn't you rather not have a bidding war and get the place for $399?
Bidding wars only mean you pay more.
Maybe you still end up paying a fair price, or even get a bargain, but you are still paying more than without the bidding war.
Frank,
no i don't mind at all - can't say enough thanks to you for the greatest site ever! and i promise i'll use your firm for my next RE transaction...
is this short sale in your building the bidding "war" you're talking about?
Bidding war or not, it's the bottom line that counts. I hate them but have been in too many to count. Some ended up being terrific deals.
As a buyer, escalation clauses can be a good thing. As a seller, I counter back the best purchaser (not "offer/price") at their highest. Forgot the clause if you are a seller; the buyer has showed his cards. If the best purchaser (down, no HI, no appraisal, etc.) doesn't take the bait, I move on to the next offer.
Don't tell any other offer that a decision has been made until you have a firm deal.
LJJ-
I think Frank's point was that you should not necessarily avoid a bidding war. In the case of the bidding war he discussed you still got a good deal and if you just avoided it because there was a bidding war you would end up paying more to get a comparable house.
NN On one of the houses I just sold in Springfield, we had multiple offers and went with the couple who did their home inspection in advance of submitting their offer. The house went on the market Friday, they did their inspection on Saturday and we had 3 offers on Monday. Their offer was not the highest, but we liked the fact that they did not have a home inspection contingency and did not ask to fix any of the very minor items they found. They did have an appraisal but made sure it happened quickly. Our agent said that when an agent knows that a property is competitive, the agent usually advises the buyer to do the home inspection first. Maybe you could do that if you saw something else good. One of the agents who submitted an offer put in a letter saying that there was no way the property would appraise and that was why they were making their offer. We did not consider that offer. The property appraised for $5,000 more than the price we accepted, which was the same as the highest offer we received. The offer we did not consider was $23,000 below the appraised value.
http://franklymls.com/DC7383277
assesed at 430K, sells at 350K,
super clean REO, i think somebody
put a good 50K into fixing it up
before they lost it.
Looks like a little fairy castle.
and 30% under if my math is correct.
http://franklymls.com/DC7401132
assessed at 320, sells at 190K,
had some works needs another 10K
to clean up, but it'd be fine.
it's a doll house but 30% isn't
bad. 4 blocks to Metro.
Agree w others, there is nothing inherently wrong with a bidding war.
Suppose a house is listed for 400K, but you think it will go for 360K, and you were prepared to write an offer of 350K.
If someone else puts in a bid of 300K are you going to say "no bidding wars for me, im out" or are you going to bid 305K?
After all, who knows, the first guy might have been putting in his max bit at 300K and the seller may be so desperate that he would take your 305K.
Frank
Dr Piggington Says the first offer you get on a house is most likely the best. There is nothing wrong with a seller taking the first offer they get after thinking on it overnight.
Sure, sometimes you can get a great deal if you bid a little higher then the other buyer, but, then the other buyer counters up and what was a great deal at 300, becomes a marginal deal at 350 or even 370.
if the other buyer snags it at 300, that sets the comps in the area, and all the other deals now focus into that.
Let a deal close at 300, and who is going to appraise at 350, down the block, either the inventory walks or prices drop.
When there is supply pressure, the best game is to walk, and suppose someone wants to fix and flip,
they have to get it, fix it up and
try and get 360, which is a hard sell in this market.
who knows, you may come in 3 months later get the really nicely fixed placed for 320K.
patience is a virtue, there is plenty of inventory and lots more coming.
welcome to Deflation.
"Pat said...
Let a deal close at 300, and who is going to appraise at 350, down the block, either the inventory walks or prices drop."
So lets see here. Say you have been looking for 5, 6 7 years now. Say your spouse is at their wits end, asking for years upon end "why cant we buy a house" when both of you know you can both well afford it.
Say too, you have been listening to hucksters on blogs, convinced that the only strategy is to wait because they are convinced massive deflation and massive inventory is "just around the corner" (even though they were wrong in 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, & 10).
Say too the hucksters told you not to bid 300K on places that were going 320K in 2009 because "much better deals are on the way", and now those same places are regularly selling for 350K+.
Say you had all those things staring you in the face. Do you continue to say "no bidding wars - ever" no matter how great the deal? Or do you engage in a bidding war if it meant you could buy a place for say 40-50K less than what you would be willing to buy it for outright?
Just curious???
Anon says:
"Say too, you have been listening to hucksters on blogs, convinced that the only strategy is to wait because they are convinced massive deflation and massive inventory is "just around the corner" (even though they were wrong in 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, & 10)."
F U and the horse you rode in on.
That applies to your cow of a wife too.
1) we have nothing to gain from our ideas. Call me a huckster again and i'll have the black slapped off you.
2) The huckssters are these people
http://www.buy-and-sell-house-fast.com/ or http://piggington.com/fence_sitters_will_be_sorry
3) You're so smart why didn't you buy in 07, sure that was a great year to buy. So piss off on that.
4) bernanke and paulsen and geithner have shot trillions into the housing market. if the market is so great why are they pushing rates lower and bribing buyers?
5) There have been good deals i've pointed out good ones and there are awesome deals in manassas, loudon, Culpepper. Cheryl bought a few and i posted some awesome deals out there.
6) you want a place, pay top dollar and STFU.
if you can't balance information, thats your problem.
Pat
PS why don't you buy a bunch of stock too.
Pat,
Whoa! No need to get so upset. Anon is just giving a counter example of frustrated bystanders, and I'm about to list a few here myself.
When do people shop? Do you want to buy things on Black Friday just after Thanksgiving, or do you want to wait until all the sales are over, when you can be the only person in the store picking over all the high priced goods? Given all the media attention to Black Friday, I'd guess that people shop when there are discounts.
Shopping in a department store is not exactly the same as buying a house, but in both cases, low pricing strategies stimulate demand, in a way that benefits both buyer and seller.
My own house hunting experience mimics Frank's Arlington condo story: on our first home tour, in March 2009 (starting our search just as the market was about to go up---BRILLIANT.....not) we saw three homes all priced at about 399k in different Leesburg neighborhoods. All were short sales, two were in fantastic condition. Those two each sold for about 435k. Since we wanted to think we were getting a deal, my husband said, "I would offer about 375k." We didn't make an offer, but we all see what would have happened had we submitted an "I'm-so-proud-of-my-discount-off-the-discount offer" kind of offer.
We really wanted to move to Fairfax County, but how many single family homes built after 2000 in Northern Fairfax County are on the market for less than 500k? In 2009, we found ONE, built on a slope just above a big drainage ditch, with a backyard that faced two busy roads. We wanted to offer 450k on a 499k short sale. The listing agent already had an offer in hand. We didn't want a bidding war. Even though we were considering a lowball, 450k seemed like a scary amount. The house sold for 468k, with a seller concession that brought the price to 450k for the buyer. We're still banging our heads against the wall about that one. Even if we had offered 470k with a 5k concession....hey, even if we offered asking price... we'd still be getting a good deal on that place. The 2009 and 2010 tax assessment for the house is 559k.
We also saw a house built in 1992, priced at 500k, in a neighborhood off Fairfax Pwy in a part of Herndon in the McLean School District. How cool is that?! The home sold for 600k. Was it a deal at the sold price? Apart from the fact that the sold price was totally out of our reach, it was the best deal to be had in that million dollar neighborhood. This example illustrates the difference between silly marketing prices and real market prices.
I'll bet anyone reading or writing on this blog who has been searching for any period of time has encountered quite a bit of competition whenever they find a low priced property. I think that multiple bids, while they do drive up the price, give clear definition to how low the market can and---more importantly---cannot go for a particular location.
Are houses overpriced, even in this age of supposed affordability? I think I agree with Elizabeth Warren on that one. However, you have to try to make a call about whether getting a good deal in today's real market terms(as opposed to some silly marketing prices) will prevent you from going underwater in the future. If you're worried about a complete collapse of the housing market, then why buy at all?
Wow pat,
I know YOU are out there pounding the pavement and I'm sure you will be one of winners. It certainly takes alot of work, time and energy to find something really good - been there.
Almost everything I purchased in the past couple of years has been in N. Reston, with good (relatively) cash flow and future propects. I've placed my bets, so to speak.
I did buy two in very close-in Sterling, right over the FX line. Newish places with a quality tenant demand.
If I bet wrong, at least I'll have good tenants and believe limited downside.
In fact, I had a closing yesterday. As I have a 15-20yr timeframe, I am not that concerned.
I did read the recent studies on 20-somethings and that many move every year. I think these applications will go in the circular file.
I was shocked to hear the number of times they move. Another interesting tidbit was the fact that 28% live with their parents. I would imagine many will move out within the next 5 yrs. In my time, the thought of moving home never entered my mind. "losers" moved home. Different times, that's for sure.
It's very interesting that the Kettler Brothers sister building went for 25% more in a year or so.
Certain areas of commercial have definitely moved off the bottom. I'll cite well located Hotels, something I know about.
newbieinNoVa,
1 comment on hotpads. It's totally out of date. There are foreclosures on there that have long since gone back to the bank, been sold to a buyer, and possible resold after a flip. So it's like an inaccurate cumulative record of hurt, not an actual list of "coming soon" REOs. And as you probably know, there have been our fair share of REOs in Springfield as well. If you want meaningful foreclosure data... when I was working with Jeff Royce from Frankly, and was actually ready to make a bid, (no point in sooner, otherwise there's too much info to sort through) he gave me the actual current status of the neighborhood. 15 houses in some stage or another of REO, 5 of which had already been successfully flipped. I decided this was a level of distress I could live with. Whether this is general Frankly policy to give out such information or not, I don't know. But it made me feel better. I know with reasonable certainty that there will continue to be REOs and shorts in my neighborhood for the next 2-5 years depending on how long the government can help banks drag this out. Bought with my eyes wide open that no appreciation would be coming soon.
On bidding wars, since I started this, my point was in this particular instance the reason for the bidding war was the "pretty" factor. That house now is as nice as it will ever look. It's already at highest and best use. So winning this particular bidding war would have led to overpaying. But Frank's point, and others have made it too, is dead on. Anything that's attractive or priced well will have multiple offers. We're all chasing that same subset of the market. That doesn't mean you shouldn't buy it.
NN,
Most times I've lost out, a better property has come along. Not always, but it's quite common.
fwiw
Sorry if this repeats a point others made, but I think one concern with bidding wars is that it is easy for some people to get carried away and bid the price up above the true market value of the property. But if you are rational, and have done the work to know what comparable properties are selling for, then set a limit on your own bidding, then IMHO the wars aren't harmful to you.
In some ways I think it's easier to overpay for a property that has been on the market a long time because of price. You know the price is too high, and you may have an idea based on comps. as to how much too high it is. But you don't really know for certain what the value is because you don't know what anyone else has bid, and comps. are never perfectly comparable, etc.
Thanks, everyone, for the advice and comments. I feel much better now :)
For me, the take-home lesson of this experience is to not get hung up on the asking price. From what I have seen so far, good agents prepare their properties well and put them on the market at very moderate prices, which inevitably results in multiple offers. So in future I will not be guided by how much above the asking price we offer, but rather by what we are ready to pay for this particular property. That is our situation; someone else will think differently.
Frank - great comment and I read your blog religiously! You are the best. I do feel like we have gone the somewhat creative route of making inspection "take it or leave it" and offering to waive 10K above the appraisal. Any more and we would have to eat into our down payment = need to pay PMI = no thank you.
I think the hardest part is to stop second-guessing because "market value" is supposed to be objective, while "what the next guy will pay" is not, yet the latter ends up determining the former. If the winning offer ended up "overpaying", how do you make the argument that they did not pay "what the market will bear", when they are indeed players in the market same as everyone else?
At the end of the day, there will be other properties. In fact, just yesterday we found three more. Not as nice and hot, but all 100K under :) Being 7 months pregnant and rrrrrready to nest does not help one be reasonable, so thank you all for keeping me grounded.
Major consolation: the house we bid on (and lost) a month ago has mysteriously gone off the market after two days of being listed "under contract". We tell ourselves it's because HI discovered hidden bodies in the basement and it became unsellable. Tee heee.
oh, NN, I can't imagine house-hunting at 7 months pregnant, in August. God save you!
Wow Pat you are quite the keyboard cowboy arent you!
So maybe it was a bit much to call you a huckster. Sure you came here telling us about "the quickening", (Mr. Mortgage's fairytale by which a huge TSUUUUUNAMMMMMMIIIIII of REO was going to get puked up en masse and drive prices into the stone age), but you didnt create it. So yes, point to you, you didnt create the fairytale, you were just another of the hucksters victims who fell prey to their tall tales.
In any event going back to your latest argument, for why you should NEVER get into a bidding war (versus my stance that sometimes a bidding war is OK) You said:
"if the other buyer snags it at 300, that sets the comps in the area, and all the other deals now focus into that.
Let a deal close at 300, and who is going to appraise at 350, down the block, either the inventory walks or prices drop."
Sounds to me like this argument above is "dont buy at 300K because it will set comps and you can get another one later at 270". Even assuming thats correct, what if anything does that have to do with your original statement that you should NEVER get into a bidding war?
Help me out here...
Contrarian -- what can I say? Yes, my online persona is a little abrasive to say the least.
Im curious, in your online persona its obvious, but in real life are you the same hardcore, died in the wool deflationist you are here? Do you tell your coworkers, in watercooler moments, "personally, I believe we are a few years away from seeing dow 400 and 90% off housing prices"?
If so, do they awkwardly nod their heads in agreement and suddenly say "gee look at the time"?
So I saw something yesterday that had just come on. LA said offers wouldn't be reviewed until Monday; I put one in anyway. My agent (and i use the term "loosely") now says LA is taking it to the seller today.
All I could say to myself was "yeah, I thought that may happen". You never know and don't ever count on what anyone says.
The better (?) LA agents will say Tuesday at 5pm and then come back at "highest and best".
Back in the day; it was " the owner ia out of town until Tuesday".
Unbelievable that we are seeing multiples and escalation claues. How in the world are we seeing a sellers' market in any area if the doomer's are correct? Stupid people?
Va_Investor said...
Unbelievable that we are seeing multiples and escalation claues. How in the world are we seeing a sellers' market in any area if the doomer's are correct? Stupid people?
You should, and probably do, know the answer to that. Any home can generate multiple bids or escalation clauses if they price it right for that. It has nothing to do with it being a buyers' or sellers' market.
Jeremy,
I thought people were too afaid to buy (further price drops, job losses, etc.) So are you saying that the only places going under contract are absolute steals?
Did NN miss a "steal"?
Has nothing sold that you thought was a good/decent buy? Do interest rates factor in at all? How about the % we are down in prices?
p.s Leroy(?) never did come back to explain how prices and affordability are higher than 20yrs ago Tick tock.
Va_Investor said...
I thought people were too afraid to buy (further price drops, job losses, etc.)
apparently many investors like yourself are not afraid. investors "put a floor" in price like you said many times.
us non-investors think differently, i'd assume, in general.
Va_Investor,
It is a well known strategy to price a place below market value to generate multiple offers and a bidding war. I would think that strategy would work in all but the worst of markets. Those places would be steals if they actually went for the initial list price - but I'm guessing that if anyone tried that and didn't get more than one offer they may just delist and try again later.
Are you saying that every home that goes under contract is getting multiple offers with escalation clauses? No. Of course I'm not saying that every place that goes under contract is an "absolute steal." I'd say that most of them aren't even good deals given the current economic situation. This generation of buyers definitely won't be getting the housing appreciation that yours did.
I'm also pretty fond of Redfin's comp listings. If you look up a property there, you see comps they suggest.
******
Kevin smith
House Sales
newbieinNovA
There's a rambler in King's Park that's going to have an open house on Sunday that isn't on the MLS yet:
8511 Parliament Drive
Springfield VA 22151
Sunday August 29, 1-4 PM.
I see the original listing that was the basis of this thread (Pimmit Hills) sold in September 2010 for $477K.
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